Russ Gibb at Random

Bring It On !

August 13, 2010

Take a look at this video. It came to me the other day. Now you make up your mind, but at least watch the whole video before you start saying that it's a conspiracy. That's an easy out. It's as easy as calling someone a racist when you disagree with them. The insult tends to stick, but it doesn't necessarily make it true. Watch the whole video and then make your comments.

Let me make my assesment of this tape. I think that some of this is real , but I also think that some of the words coming out of Obama's mouth in the first part of this video have been put there by clever editing. My own opinion is that he was not born in the United States, and there are lots of things pointing in that direction. Mr. Obama can solve this issue by producing vault copies of his birth certificate. Why doesn't he do this? Now there's the question.

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51 Comment(s)

For Gods sake, why in the world are we demonizing Islam? It the rest of the world, many look upon Christians and Catholics as the most blood thirsty and violent of all religions. If we use history as a guide, they are correct! Christians and Catholics have a long and bloody history of "convert or die." Is it that we are going to fall for the mainstream media's depiction of all Muslims as blood thirsty murderers? If so, is it any wonder that the rest of the world thinks Americans are a bunch of greedy and intolerant savages?

Every religion has its extremists, Islam is no exception. There are Christians and Catholics here in the United States who thought rounding up people who were "less than perfect" and sterilizing them was acceptable as recently as the 60's. There are Christians and Catholics who are blowing up abortion clinics and murdering doctors in the name of God. This country, in its short history, endorsed slavery while “In God We Trust.” In our short life as a country, we denied women the right to vote (because they were viewed as property, not as people) and for many years, didn’t let women do things like drive a car or go to school. How does this make us better than extremist Muslims? There are still God fearing Christians in this country who think bigamy is totally acceptable and is their right, yet as a country, we want to demonize Islam? We have experimented on unsuspecting soldiers with drugs, we have recruited Nazis for our own biological weapons programs, and the list goes on and on! Our country could not exist if not for the mass genocide of American Indians by the United States government. How do Americans, Catholics or Christians take any moral high ground against Muslims or Middle Easterners when looking at our own short history?

Islam has been around sense the 600’s, yet somehow, Christians are going to take the moral high ground despite a couple thousand years of horrible behavior in comparison. How about Catholics ? How many died in the Inquisition? Convert of die was the job of the Catholics as the rest of the world were deemed heretics. How many children’s lives were ruined in churches by pervert priests? How many dirty deals with the mafia have there been at the Vatican that we know about?

Everyone wants to throw the Muslim faith in the garbage for the acts of a few guys on 9-11 (most of who were from countries who are our ALLIES from organizations that the CIA funded and continues to fund). We want to make Islam the devil and what is the main beef for you Anti-Obama freaks? He’s a Muslim! JFK was a Catholic, why wasn’t anyone screaming that he was not going to round up heretics and torture them until they converted?

Call Obama what you want, but for the love of God, don’t throw the entire faith of Islam under the bus because you think Obama is a Muslim. George W Bush is no Muslim and how many Iraqi and Afghan non combatants were killed during his time in the White House?

--by Oh Brother! on 8/13/10   Lives: USA  

I dont mean to offend. BUT ?????

--by terry on 8/14/10   Lives: Michigan  

When Muslims stand up against violance in the name of Islam. When Muslims stand against terror. When Muslims follow the law of THIS land when here. When Muslims respect that Shiria Law does not belong in the US. THat is when I will stop throwing the Muslim faith in the garbage. Non exteme Christians stand up against abortion clinic bombings. Non extreme Christians stand up against the murder of non Christians. There is no EXTREME Muslims when they do not stand up against terrorism. When Muslims stand up for MY religious freedom, I will accept some of them as extremist and some as religious. Until then, when you lay with dogs you get fleas. When you accept the behavior of some in your group without speaking up against it, you are just as bad as them.

--by When on 8/14/10   Lives: Dearborn  

To the poster who calls him/herself WHEN:

You could just as easily change the world MUSLIM in your post to CHRISTIAN or CATHOLIC and nothing would be different. Muslims all over the world renounce violence in the form of terrorism! Problem is that you choose to ignore that kind of information because that is exactly what you, as an American, are conditioned to do. The media has taught you to be afraid of your own shadow and hate everything you don’t understand!

I see exactly the same amount of fundamentalist Christians and fanatical Catholics renouncing abortion clinic bombings as you do fundamentalist Muslims renouncing terrorism. Muslims should not be expected to take responsibility for the actions of terrorists just as you are not expected to take responsibility for abortion clinic bombers.

The most astonishingly ignorant thing you could have said in response to my OP was "When you accept the behavior of some in your group without speaking up against it, you are just as bad as them." This equates to an ignorant swing in the dark. I am not, nor have ever been a Muslim. I have no Muslims in my Family and never have. I am a Christian and an American and I respect the right of anyone to practice their religion as they wish and don’t stand in judgment of anyone. Like the rest of my family, it is beneath us to attack or fear anyone for simply being a Muslim or any other religion. America ceases to be America when fearful people like you became so afraid of everything and everyone that you forgot what our Constitution was written for and what your holey book says. People who hate Muslims just for being Muslim are no better than terrorists who hate Americans for being American.

Seeing as how you are so big on taking responsibility for the sins of your fellow God fearing Americans like the Klu Klux Klan can I assume you have spoken out against them recently? How about the American Nazi Party? They do what they do on the word of God and good old American ideals. Have you stepped up to verbally challenge them? Perhaps you should get your glass house in order before you cast stones at others.

Here in the USA, you’re a lot less likely to have your head lopped off for criticizing the KKK or the American Nazi Party. Over in Afghanistan, you would likely watch your family murdered and be be-headed for speaking out publicly against the Taliban. Millions of Iraqi’s risked their lives to vote a couple years ago yet here, we can’t even get ¼ of our population out of their air conditioning to do it. I would say that makes them pretty courageous people and us pretty lazy and hypocritical.

--by Oh Brother on 8/15/10   Lives: Michigan  

To 'Oh Brother': You ask why anyone would 'demonize' Islam, and then you provide the answer yourself. "Over in Afghanistan, you would likely watch your family murdered and be be-headed for speaking out publicly against the Taliban." That is also true in the Gaza strip, in southern Lebanon, in Iran and many other Muslim-controlled places if one speaks out against the religious rulers. That is what is wrong with Islam.

And to your first posting, you want to use the Spanish Inquisition to draw comparisons to today's butchery by Muslims? Before, during and after the Spanish Inquisition, Muslims were conducting their own murderous campaigns in many locales. The whole world has a history of barbarism, not just Christians. Try looking into the genocide directed at the Armenians, for example. How about the Barbary pirates that our Marines subdued? Those were murderous actions by Muslims. Today, in this world currently, we have widespread, bloodthirsty actions by Muslims. Shooting missles into Israel? 'Other' Muslims don't care. Machine-gunning Israeli schoolchildren on their bus? 'Other' Muslims don't care. Using machetes to lop off the heads of 12-year-old girls on their way to Christian school in the Phillipines? 'Other' Muslims don't care. There has been NO public outcry by 'other' Muslims to these atrocities. None.

Yet, when a newspaper publishes cartoons of Muhammed, 'other' Muslims are outraged. You say I haven't stood up in public and denounced the KKK or the Nazi Party? I would happily demonstrate against them if they came to town. In the meantime the public press does plenty of denouncing for me. When it comes to terrorist Muslims, what do we get from the press? We get statements that the 'US Government defines them as a terrorist group' as though Hezbollah and Hamas don't demonstrate their status every day.

Ask the Muslims of Dearborn how they view Hezbollah and Hamas. It doesn't matter how bloodthirsty those groups are, how murderous. The Muslims of Dearborn support them, because those groups are Muslim. Period.

And you ask why anyone would demonize Islam? That is why.

--by Dearborn Citizen on 8/15/10   Lives: Dearborn  

The ignorance is that you thought that I was talking directly to you. It was the generic YOU I was referring to. I was not implying you are Muslim or anything else. I just presume you have no real interaction with the Muslim community as I do. I have stood up to many of people who use the N word, who are against Jews and those who support rascism. Millions of Americans died for my right to vote too (dont worry, I have NEVER missed an election). It is really easy to sit and not see what is happening to this country that is so easy to accept others, even when that means the attempt to bring Shiria Law to the US. Even when that means they do not respect the laws of this country they want to live in-women are second class citizens, Dealer plate and intransit plates illegally used, the beating and rape of women becuase it is the right of the man. Really really look at what you are talking about and tell me you want Shiria Law here.

--by Not convinced on 8/15/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Unfortunately, every time I see a news story about a police officer tazering an 11 year old special ed child, or see video footage of water cannons being used on blacks who were peacefully protesting in the south or even GW Bushes Patriot act being renewed, I contend that we were and are already living closer to Shiria law than you all may think. What is so bad about Shiria law anyway? Random beatings for what you believe? Being dragged away and beaten or imprisoned with no due process? People disappearing off the street and taken away to be imprisoned without charges or a trial? Phone tapping, Email recording, racial profiling, random search and seizures, church burnings, hell, we have all that here in the US RIGHT NOW! What is going on over in Afghanistan is no different than what the Klan and the Alabama State Police did (and continues to do) down south or what the LAPD does in California today.

Nothing or no one will ever convince the brain washed masses here in Dearborn or anywhere else in the country that the vast majority of Muslims are repulsed by terrorist acts and groups. You won’t believe it because all you know is what you see on TV. That’s the extent of your knowledge. The fact is that in the shadow of 9-11, Americans have been totally brainwashed to hate all Muslims period! Moreover, speaking as someone who has been in the Middle East Post Desert Storm, no one was more disgusted by groups like Hammas, Hezbollah, Al-Quada, and the Taliban than the majority of people who live there. Hell, the US government created, funded and armed the Taliban when they liked to kill Soviets only to see them turn on us. We created Saddam Hussein to kill Iranians and Manual Noriega to produce drugs to fund illegal gorilla wars in Central and South America. Considering that, at some point, many of these “terrorist groups” were created, supported, funded or armed by the US and its coalition forces makes one wonder why these folks don’t know who to trust.

The reality is that by constantly trying to impose western culture at gunpoint in the Middle East, we will continue to feed the resentment and make these groups stronger and stronger. People come here to escape the crossfire between these groups and coalition forces and they come with a lot of baggage and distrust of this country.

When some of you people who think you know how Muslims in the Middle East think, get on a C130 and go over there for a couple years, than come back and tell us about it. If you are relying on what you hear in the news, I can tell you from experience, you are not even close!

I’m not by any means suggesting that we embrace the ideals of fanatical terrorist organizations or Islamic fascists. I am suggesting, however, that the faith of Islam is NOT to blame for terrorism no more than Christianity is to blame for the KKK or Catholicism is to blame for the Inquisition. It was the LEADERS of the day and the suckers who mindlessly believed and followed them that are to blame. As a population, we need to stop repeating history in allowing our government and media to brainwash us into hating millions of people for how they warship God. Speak to what you know, not to what others are paid to have you believe!

--by Get the FACTS, not the NEWS on 8/15/10   Lives: USA  

Regards "get the facts not the news" His comments are wordy and loaded with biased scraps of historical misinformation. His point about the news media is well taken. Sad he does not know how to be concise.

--by Teller on 8/15/10   Lives: Detroit area  

What is sad is how the attention span of the average American adult is now measured in seconds. 90% of this country would have been lost after the first two sentences. Perhaps words with fewer syllables and a commercial or two and some nudity would make that posting easier for the average American adult to follow.

--by Gradey on 8/16/10   Lives: USA  

At first I thought you were just a person with a different opinion. Now I realize you SCARE me! Comparing Shiria Law to LAPD, seriously, you are ignorant.
Let me tell you, I do not get my knowledge from the news. I get it from the life that I have lived. I watch about 20 minutes of news coverage at the most each month and refuse to read online news from the Obama kissing media. It makes me to upset and raises my BP to an unhealthy level. So before you tell me where I get my knowledge from come live my life and then determine I was brainwashed. by whom? The Muslims? that is where I get my knowledge from. No wonder Obama could get elected and Muslims will take over this country and ruin it, because people like you will allow it to happen.

--by Get the facts on 8/16/10   Lives: Dearborn  

WOW! From all that information, you come back with "Comparing Shiria Law to LAPD?" That’s it?

You’re afraid of Obama, Muslims, Shiria, and the media. So you don’t look at the Media or read news on line. If you get your information from your life experiences, I would sure love to know where you hang out to get all your information on the Siria, Muslims, Obama and the Media just to name a few things. Or do you get all you need from the 20 minutes a month of coverage you get before Tachycardia sets in?

I am thinking you have spent a lot of time recently in the Middle East, Europe, New York, and everywhere else Muslims are as well as Washington, the Pentagon, and in the situation room to gather your information to build your non-media based opinions. You must have quite a travel log and amazing access to government to have all that information at your disposal.

I suppose we are on the same page, I too am scared of the gross and increasing ignorance and intolerance that pours from your every single response. I can’t wait to hear where you get all your information to base your rampant fear of everything on.

--by Please tell us more! on 8/16/10   Lives: USA  

Where do I get my information? Well, I live and work in Dearborn. I grew up here, I see what has happened and is happening to this city. I see that the " broke city" is spending money to keep lights on in the middle of the night so Muslims can practice at night, if we spent extra money to support a Christian group, the ACLU would file suit. I see the money spent for teachers and information to be bi-lingual when my family came here they learned English because they had no choice. I see people scared to speak up against groups that want to kill Americans and the American dream, yet cannot say anything because that makes them racist, yet if it is negativity against Christians (which I am not just FYI), that is acceptable. I see this in the life I live, I dont have to have to media give me my information, I can see it with my own eyes. Before you jump all over me for beign from Dearborn, just becuase I was born here and live here now does not mean I have never left. I have lived in many different states and have traveled extensively. I have been places where I have to cover my hair becuase I am a women-not becuase of my religion but becuase of what is forced on me by that country. I have traveled enough to know that when I go to a foreign country I am expected to follow their customs and laws, not bring my own. I know that American is a cultual all her own and to say that we should tolerate others extremism becuase it is their cultual ignores the fact that America has it's own culture and that is a culture that allows for other points of view and allows for women to be first class not second class citizens.

--by Insulted on 8/17/10   Lives: Dearborn  

First of all, who is jumping all over you? Can’t someone disagree with you without you making it an attack? You’re very typical of most people in this country who can’t debate differences of opinion without taking it personally. I really think you, like many other Americans that have blind hatred, need to grow up and start being a little more rational and less scared of your own shadow and get in touch with the Constitution of your own country!

You live in a small town in one state and used to travel around a little and base your entire view of one of the biggest systems of belief based on what? We leave the lights on at night, Women choose to observe their religious beliefs? Go visit a mall in Dearborn, you will see that Middle Eastern Muslims are picking up plenty of our morally bankrupt western culture and customs. Now they act just as horrible as American kids do! They swear, disrespect everyone and authority figures, They lie, cheat and steal, they do drugs, dress like prostitutes and pimps, pretty much all of the things Americans do all the time now a days.

The vast majority of Muslin newcomers I have met are clean, polite, respectful, and hard working. Many are business owners and very family oriented. Mothers raise thier kids, They take time to prey several times a day and don’t force anyone else to do it. Most American born kids, Christian or Muslim alike, act horribly! Maybe you had better stick your head out of your little corner of Dearborn and go visit a mall anywhere in the US sometime.

How can you base your hatred of like 1/5 of the world’s population because we "keep the lights on?" We don’t ALL benefit from street lights? So you equate keeping lights in the streets on as being exclusive to Muslims, but you think our government spending millions upon millions to push one religion over all others as serving 100% of the population? Are you KIDDING ME?

Reguarding "people scared to speak up against groups"I have seen, with my own eyes, the aftermath of A Muslim village elder that lived in a Muslim country beheaded for speaking out against a Muslim Taliban chief for stealing food from their village. They lined his daughters up, ordered them disemboweled alive while he watched, and than they beheaded him and his wife as a lesson to others. Save your whining about Christians being afraid to speak out here in the US. It sickens me compared to what many of these people have endured. Next time you go on vacation, go visit Mogadishu or Kunar Province.

--by The Constitution READ IT! on 8/17/10   Lives: USA  

To 'The Constitution..': You really rattle on, don't you? Yes, you attacked 'Insulted' for being uninformed. You seem to be obviously Muslim, despite anything you say. The 'lights being left on' referred to the Fordson football team practicing football at midnight because of the Muslim religion...despite the fact that they can make exceptions to the fasting rule - all the Imams say so. So the school system is paying for unnecessary lights, the neighbors have to put up with the glaring lights and the noise - football coaches blow whistles, remember.

You give examples of the Taliban cruelly murdering innocents as if that makes the fear that non-Muslims feel in Dearborn non-existent...but that kind of cruel, murderous imposition of Islamic rule is EXACTLY what the non-muslims fear! Every murderous action by the Taliban is claimed to be justified because of what is written in the Koran. If you have read the Koran, you can see the language there that exhorts Muslims to kill or subjugate all non-Muslims. Yes, the many despotic and bloodthirsty leaders have a lot to do with all the jihad killing, but their job of selling death is made much easier by what is called 'sacred' writings of Islam. That killing is taking place today, all over the world, in the name of Islam. Can it be stopped without stopping Islam itself? That is the question, isn't it? So why should ANY non-Muslim think that imposing midnight football practice - in the name of Islam - on the neighborhood is benign, and not another step in forcing MORE people to live under Muslim rules?

By the way, you do know that there are still many more Christians in the world than there are Muslims, don't you?

To hate jihad and its violence is not the same as hating all Muslims. To note that Hezbollah and Hamas are terrorist groups who murder the innocent is not to hate all Muslims. To note that anyone - anyone - who supports those terrorist groups is anti-American, is not to hate all Muslims. You need to look at facts, not bash America.

--by What???? on 8/22/10   Lives: Dearborn  

I’m sorry that you take the assertion that your being uninformed, based on your ridicules responses from fear and ignorance, but I call them like I see them. I tell you I’m not a Muslim, you don’t believe me, whoopdy do! What difference does it make? Personally, I don’t believe you’re a Christian! I believe you think you are, but most Christians don’t hate on others just for the way they warship or hold a whole belief system responsible for just a few terrorists. By the way, when is the last time YOU read the Bible? Let me point out just a few verses:

In Leviticus 25:44-46, the Lord tells the Israelites it’s OK to own slaves, provided they are strangers or heathens.

In Samuel 15:2-3, the Lord orders Saul to kill all the Amalekite men, women and infants.

In Exodus 15:3, the Bible tells us the Lord is a man of war.

In Numbers 31, the Lord tells Moses to kill all the Midianites, sparing only the virgins.

In Deuteronomy 13:6-16, the Lord instructs Israel to kill anyone who worships a different God or who worships the Lord differently. Sounds VERY intolerant doesn’t it?

In Mark 7:9, Jesus is critical of the Jews for not killing their disobedient children as prescribed by Old Testament law.

In Luke 19:22-27, Jesus orders killed anyone who refuses to be ruled by him.

I could go on all day long like this because I know the Bible, and I know the Quran. Apparently, you know neither.

Context is important, of course, and many of these seeming cruelties disappear when read as such. However, this would not stop a Christian terrorist from interpreting the Bible in a manner necessary to concoct a religious justification for unspeakable horrors. Take for instance Pope Urban II. He preached the First Crusade in 1095. American preachers invoked Bible law when they used Leviticus to defend slavery. Now all those abortion clinic bombers state that they are doing exactly what the Bible preaches, by your logic, that makes Christians as bad or worse than Muslims. Why worse? Because you don’t think you’re any different. Hitler believed that he was ordained by God himself to rid the world of Jews. How many people died in the Jonestown massacre back in 78 in the name of God?

Just like people warp the word of the Bible to justify horrible acts, as do those with the Quran and the Talmud.

As for rattling on and on, please go get some facts and come on back and comment, 90% of your assertions are un-supported by common sense and the rest are just false and come from a place of ignorance and fear. I may be rattling, but your reading. There may be hope for you!

--by Did I studder? on 8/22/10   Lives: USA  

OK Experts... try this on..I have often wondered why it is that the conservatives are called the "right" and the liberals are called the "left."

I came upon this verse in the Bible:

Ecclesiastes 10:2 (NIV) "The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left."

--by Dan on 8/22/10   Lives: Dearborn  

To 'Did I Studder? (sic): You apparently don't know the Bible as well as you think. The verse from Luke you cite does not quote Jesus as ordering people killed. It cites Jesus as relating a parable about a rich man.

I have a question for you. you state that 'context' is important. There is context in the Bible, as noting that a parable is not the same as a direct quote. There is no context in the Koran, however. The chapters, or suras, are basically arranged in order of length. How do you pull context out of that?

You also denounced Pope Urban II for starting the Crusade. Did you forget that the middle east areas meant to be re-conquered by the Crusade were first conquered by Muslims on a jihad? To many Muslims in Dearborn, violent Muslims around the world are to be celebrated. If you are not Muslim, how can that attitude not worry you?

--by Dearborn Citizen on 8/23/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Did Ecclesiastes mean his left or my left?

--by קֹהֶלֶת‎, on 8/23/10   Lives: USA  

To "Did I Stutter?" : You state that my assertions are unsupported by common sense. Please give an example of that. It is certainly common sense that in today's world, it is Muslims who are murdering other Muslims who are of a different sect, and Muslims who are murdering non-Muslims. Those Muslims claim they are justified by what they consider sacred writings. These are not my opinions, but simple facts.

Any Christians who justify murder by quoting the Bible are very few and far between and are publicly denounced. Muslims who murder on religious grounds are plentiful and are not publicly denounced by other Muslims. These are simple facts.

It is ignorance itself to equate the violence of Muslims - worldwide and widely supported by other Muslims - to the the violence of isolated Christians.

--by What???? on 8/23/10   Lives: Dearborn  

I could sit here for a week and pick apart your ignorance on matters of religious population, Islamic customs, history of Christianity, and guarantee you that if given the opportunity, could expose your total and complete unfamiliarity with the doctrine of your faith or any other faith for that matter, but what difference would it make? Your so self absorbed and full of hate that you wouldn’t get it anyway!

Instead of that, I will suggest that you are mantling 1.6 bullion Muslims with the responsibility of poor behavior by just a few. That pretty much says all there is to say about your shortsighted, fearful ignorance and common sense. Based on the numbers of non-Christians murdered by Christians in recorded history, the reality is that Christians have shown the most disregard for human life in the name of their belief system. That wouldn’t matter, because you wouldn’t hear it and know nothing about history! You only know what you see when you look out the window.

You know nothing about Christianity, Islam, History, and when given examples of events and examples, you can only come back with rants about leaving lights on, how much you hate Muslims and than throw in unfounded and incorrect historical fats.

In short, to argue a point with someone who is so sheltered and unknowledgeable and has such a narrow in their world view and so lacking in historical knowledge is proving to be a worthless venture! People post facts, supported by examples, you post opinions, vagaries and hatred. You’re a typical scared, intolerant and ignorant American who thinks the whole world is about you and your opinions. You know nothing about the customs and culture of other belief systems and nationalities. So instead of becoming educated about other cultures, you fear and attack them, just like you have been trained to do by the media you say you never watch.

--by I pitty you on 8/23/10   Lives: USA  

so, you ignored the request to cite examples of 'non-supported' statements, so all we have to contemplate is your rejection of America. To you, it is America and Americans that are the problem. You have also revealed your hatred of Christianity. It is very apparent that you are in denial of reality. The fact is, it is not Islamophobia to fear violence from violent people.

--by Dearborn Citizen on 8/23/10   Lives: Dearborn  

My money is on this America-hating poster really being one of the leaders of AAPAC. His writing is good, even as he hates America and everything in it.

--by What??? on 8/23/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Just a question from the sideline to the one who called themselves "I Pitty You." What was the incorrect historical fact? I am reading the back and forth here and trying to keep up.

--by From the sideline on 8/23/10   Lives: Dearborn  

I pitty you, needs a lot more education. As his rant is as full of half truths and mis-informaton as the guy he is ranting about. He does need help.

--by al on 8/23/10   Lives: Detroit area  

"we have to contemplate is your rejection of America"

I’m sorry, where was "America Rejected?"

"America and Americans that are the problem"

No, not all Americans are sheltered hate-mongers. Just the few who want to blame 1.6 billion Muslims for the actions of a couple thousand. That’s why no one here has condemned America as a whole. If someone did, perhaps you could point that out.

"You have also revealed your hatred of Christianity"

OK, where did anyone say that anyone "hated Christianity??” The point alluded to was that most Christians don’t even know their own believe system, let alone trying to understand others. Of course, I have always found that if someone is looking to pick a fight, they can find any reason to do so.

"It is very apparent that you are in denial of reality."

I guess that depends on which reality you speak of! If it’s a reality where we can’t live in a country where people can express their opinions, warship the way they want and live without persecution, I and millions of other fair minded Americans reject your reality of hatred and racism. Just as some here have accused Muslims of not standing in revile of the horrible acts of terrorists, I, as an American, refuse to stand while some ignorant hate-monger condemns ANY Americans or any peaceful religion without any foundation other than hate! Many of you say Islam is not a “peaceful religion,” and I point out that Christianity, like ALL religions (except maybe Buddhists) has plenty of blood on its hands. You can’t call Islam a barbaric religion without accepting that Christians have acted in the past just as badly or worse in the name of God!

"The fact is, it is not Islamophobia to fear violence from violent people."

Funny you should call it "Islamophobia" as any Phobia, by definitions “an irrational or very powerful fear and dislike of something." Note the word IRRATIONAL! You yourself hit the nail on the head.

Most rational people do not live in fear of violence, but rather are vigilant. To live in fear of violence makes you a prisoner of fear. Clearly, some of you are serving a life sentence.

"My money is on this America-hating poster really being one of the leaders of AAPAC"

If the leadership of AAPAC is willing to stand up and point out fear and ignorance despite wave after wave of fear-driven hatred, hell, SIGN ME UP! Problem is that AAPAC is only interested in furthering the political ambitions of its members. We already have a city hall full of non-Arabs who belong to AAPAC. Sorry, I have less use for politicians than worthless hate-mongers like some of you. I would rather go to a Tiger game with any of you before anyone from AAPAC or city hall. At least most of your wear your bigotry on your sleeve.

His writing is good, even as he hates America and everything in it.

Thanks for the complement, but I must have missed the part where I said I hated America and everything in it. The reality, like most rational people who don’t walk around afraid of their own shadows, I hate hostility, bigotry and fearful small minded zealots who don’t even know what they are afraid of. And by the way……………HE? God forbid a WOMAN has an opinion around here!

"What was the incorrect historical fact"

Christianity, per-say is NOT the largest religion in the world. That is a glairing generality. Once the broad generality of Christianity is broken into its radically different sects (Catholicism, Baptist, Greek Orthodox, Protestant, Snake Handler, etc) the most fundamental form of Christianity (non denominational Christians) are among the minority among world religions. Islam has far fewer sects, thus is far less splintered than Christian based belief systems.

"As his rant is as full of half truths"

So are you one of those people who don’t think the holocaust, the Inquisition, the Crusades, Jonestown, etc, never happened? Hmmmmm. Are you saying there are NOT 1.6 millions Muslims? In the context of the conversation, where are there half truths and perhaps you could address the whole truths for us. And there you go with the HIS thing again!

Finally, DEARBORN CITIZEN, you, like so many people here, completely missed the point of quoting Bible scripture. The point was that context is EVERYTHING! I clearly stated that, and posted examples to support that. That response was addressing the assertion that:

"If you have read the Koran, you can see the language there that exhorts Muslims to kill or subjugate all non-Muslims."

The posted scriptures were meant to show that any scriptures (Bible, Talmud, or Quran) can be used out of context to project hatred. Apparently, you failed to make the connection when I clearly posted the issue of CONTEXT. Could I recommend next time you read it for what it says, not what you think it means. Problem in many of you see what you want to see in the “other guys/gals” words, and only see the beauty in your own.

--by OK WHOSE NEXT on 8/23/10   Lives: USA  

What a thread. Only in dearborn.

I'd like to applaud the poster, who i assume is the same person - "I Pitty you" "Oh bother" etc for defending our American way of life. Ive lived in the heart of east dearborn all my life and find it funny how people get so bent out of shape and foam at the mouth whenever they hear the word muslim. Yes, does the eastend have alot of problems, with dealer plates, insurance fraud, etc, yes of course. No one denies that. But i dont see how that is a good argument to despise muslims? Its like saying the Irish in this country 100 years ago were filthy, dirty and scumbags who ruined cities. Yeah maybe alot of them were, but is that any reason to despise the catholic faith? Let alone ALL Irish?

One poster complained about "So why should ANY non-Muslim think that imposing midnight football practice - in the name of Islam - on the neighborhood is benign, and not another step in forcing MORE people to live under Muslim rules?"

What a ridiculous statement. Why can't these kids be both muslim and american at the same time? Despite what you think, did you know that for hundreds of years, especially in the late 1800s, that immigrant families have been "accommodated" by the public schools? For example, public dollars were used to pay for instruction in the native tongues of eastern Europeans- read your books please.

If letting a few jocks play during the night time so that they dont pass out during the day is sharia law, well then I guess we have been living under Sharia law for a long time.

All I hear is that you are afraid to speak up because the boogey man will get you, yet you dont have any problem speaking your mind here. So which one is it? Is the Sharia so bad that you are really afraid to speak? Buddy, its in your mind. And if someone accuses you of being a racist and you cannot take the heat- well grow some why dont you and come back with a better argument.

And speaking of "racist" language. Let's analyze yours (assuming of course this is the same person)

"To hate jihad and its violence is not the same as hating all Muslims. To note that Hezbollah and "Hamas are terrorist groups who murder the innocent is not to hate all Muslims. To note that anyone - anyone - who supports those terrorist groups is anti-American, is not to hate all Muslims. You need to look at facts, not bash America."
--by What???? on 8/22/10 Lives: Dearborn

That is about the most sensible thing you have said. Unfortunately, you have not said anything that could be interpreted as presenting such a "nuananced view" that you seem to assert here.
For instance...

"Ask the Muslims of Dearborn how they view Hezbollah and Hamas. It doesn't matter how bloodthirsty those groups are, how murderous. The Muslims of Dearborn support them, because those groups are Muslim. Period.
And you ask why anyone would demonize Islam? That is why.

--by Dearborn Citizen on 8/15/10 Lives: Dearborn"

"No wonder Obama could get elected and Muslims will take over this country and ruin it, because people like you will allow it to happen. "
--by Get the facts on 8/16/10 Lives: Dearborn

"Until then, when you lay with dogs you get fleas. When you accept the behavior of some in your group without speaking up against it, you are just as bad as them. "
--by When on 8/14/10 Lives: Dearborn

All of this seems pretty hateful to me. The structure and syntax of these statements are pretty damn similar to those used by radicals who want certain ethnic/religious groups to be "removed." Note, im not saying you ARE a racist(or a bigot, etc), but that your language is racialized. You might want to watch what you say because otherwise you end up sounding like some of the world's least favorite historical figures.

Lastly, give me ONE example where a legislature in the United States of America has instituted sharia law? Please, tell me. I'd love to visit.

--by eastend/eastside on 8/23/10   Lives: Dearborn  

A legislature? How about the U-M Dearborn act of installing Muslim footbaths with public money? How about Mayor O'Reilly insisting that news of an armed jihadist in Hemlock Park be kept under wraps - so as to reduce the danger to Muslims? How about the Fordson principal the last few years cancelling proms and other social activities and firing long-time wresting coaches because of extremist Muslim beliefs? How about Dearborn police arresting Christian people at a public festival because the festival was Muslim?

You claim that pointing out simple facts about life in Dearborn is 'hateful.' I have had Muslims of different ages tell me in public that Hezbollah and Hamas are 'soldiers of god' and that it is 'really America' who is the terrorist because they kill Muslims. When a statement reflecting those public statements by Muslims is printed here, you want to call it 'hateful.' It is the simple truth. By the way, Islam is a religion. Denouncing Islam's violence and the way that the violence is accepted and even applauded by so many Muslims cannot be defined as 'racist.'

Now, the Arab-Muslims who have murdered hundreds of thousands and displaced millions of African-Muslim people in Darfur...those are racists.

--by Dearborn Citizen on 8/24/10   Lives: Dearborn  

By the logic of one poster out here, I think I should be embarrassed and angry by the words, thoughts, and hatred being posted by my fellow, so called, Christian Americans. A poster suggested one’s own people should stand in protest and denounce the offensive behavior of their own people when acting so.

As both a Christian and an American, I denounce these people who hate all based on the actions of some, be it Muslims or anyone else. It is sad to see people who call themselves Christians acting like this.

The problem today is that these fair-weather Christians are the only voice. This is what our culture of fear has created. Seldom any more do we hear true Christians standing on scripture for tolerance, love and acceptance. That does not sell well in our culture any more. Our popular culture glorifies hatred and violence, especially against Muslims. We use fear and the Bible to embolden and justify this hatred against those who are not like us. Today, it is Muslims that we are taught to hate, perhaps tomorrow, it may be any of you. If you fall for the fervor of hatred, others will too. The problem is that it may be you that they hate. Who will than defend you against them?

Seeing as we are quoting bible scripture:

Mat 25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done [it] unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done [it] unto me.

Muslims are people too. No true Christian has the right to judge them or anyone because the day will come in this life or the next, that you will be the one to be judged.

--by Lets take a deep breath, and ask for strength on 8/24/10   Lives: Dearborn  


Reading over all this stuff, something occurred to me. I watch city council meetings, attend school board meetings, and vote in every election. I have seen plenty of citizen’s step up and be heard on issues much like the ones that are cited here on this exchange. I have some simple questions to all of these fearful people who are here protesting the behavior of Muslims in our community:

Where are all of you at city council meetings?

Where are you at school board meetings?

Why aren’t any of you running for city council or the school board if they are so bad?

Why do you all just complain in anonymity instead of doing something about it?

If not for the Middle Eastern people and Muslims of Dearborn, Dearborn would be an extension of Detroit. I don't know if any of you have looked around, but without the Arabic owned businesses, your city would be a slum with no businesses like Detroit. Warren ave. would look like the Warren Ave. in Detroit as would Michigan Ave and Ford Road.

God help Dearborn if not for Arabic and Muslim businesses. You think its bad now, you better thank God you will not see it without these people occupying these buildings.

--by ديربورن مقيم on 8/24/10   Lives: USA  

Russ, Russ, Russ,

You must be sitting back and smiling at all the mayhem that you create by putting on line all the "information" that you post.

I'll just say in my own tree-hugging, hippy, love everyone way "Let there be peace on earth, and let it begin with me".

Have a great day and post this if it isn't too normal and non-judgmental enough to make your blog.

--by cloe on 8/24/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Warping the facts about Muslims and applying a separate set of expectation to them over others is what is hateful.

Do you know how much stuff the current and former Mayors of Dearborn have covered up about everything you can imagine? usually, it's because there is going to be a payoff to prevent a very public lawsuit in the future. That has nothing to do with Muslims, that has to do with corruption. Coverups are not just matters of Islamic Dearbornites, some non-Muslims abuse the system plenty! For instance, it was not Muslims who were sent to jail for ethics violations in the B&S scandal, but I am sure you will find a way to blame Muslims. If you have a beef with what the Mayor is covering up, I suggest that you stop electing the guy over and over again!

If your going to take U of M to task for installing foot baths with public money, than get the 10 commandments, nativity scenes and every other secular Christian symbol out of public venues. Christians do not get a free pass becaue YOU think so. You cant have a double standard because you hate Islam and love Christianity.

As for Imad Fadallah, right or wrong, his actions were condoned 100% by the board of education. Take your issues up with them! You elected them. I didn't see ANY of you at school board meetings protesting. You all sat on your hands and remained silent. Just like all those Muslims who you say silently condoned violence, you all just sat back and let it happen at Fordson. Once again, we have our non-Muslim Dearborite Christians showing up with a double standard.

I don't give a damn what the religion is of people who get arrested if they are disorderly and deserve to be arrested. What event are you referring to and I will get the arrest numbers for the entire event. lets see how correct your facts are. You, for some reason, want to point out only the non-Muslims who were arrested!

Pointing out facts about Muslims is not hateful, but framing it as though Christians are perfect and blaming every Muslim for the acts of a few is hateful and ignorant to boot.

Hatred is Muslims has become hatred of Arabs in Dearborn, the undercurrent is clear! It's like when Dearborn tried to say that outsiders cant use Dearborn parks. What they meant was the black people cant use Dearborn parks. At that time, the only people that were being asked for ID in our parks were black. They were easy to identify becasue back than, there were very few blacks living in Dearborn. Get the picture? Islamic discrimination IS Arabic discrimination by association.

Finally, how many Muslims have been displaced by coalition forces in the war on terror? Are you going to say that innocent Iraqi's and Afgans who lost everything to accidental bombing raids and collateral damage deserved it because they are Muslims and the Coalition forces were simply after bad Muslims? Of course, in your mind, that's OK because it's killing bad guys in a far away land and to you they are ALL bad because they are Muslims. Here, for the sake of argument, you want to bring up Darfur? Talk about a huge double standard!

Once again, everything in your posting Dearborn Citizen is 100% self serving and a double standard.

--by Double your fun! on 8/24/10   Lives: Dearborn  

This is for mr lawyer called "double your fun." *Law of Logical Argument
Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.

--by Sy on 8/24/10   Lives: Dearborn  

According to Mr. 'Double your fun', the non-Muslims of Dearborn are to blame for Fadlallah's Muslim actions at Fordson. I went back to read the thread, and Fadlallah's actions are examples of how Muslim values are replacing American values in, how exactly are the NON-Muslims to blame for Fadlallah's actions? This is an example of twisting of words, it seems to me.

--by Question on 8/29/10   Lives: Dearborn  

'Double Your Fun' sure twists things around to claim that being anti-violent Muslim is to be racist. The Filipino Muslims who kill Christian schoolchildren are not Arabic. Their problem is not their race, but the murderous brand of Islam they follow. And, to clarify things, I am not Christian. I am not religious at all. The Arab-Muslims who kill African Muslims in Darfur are clearly racist. You can't hide that fact with your ranting.

For decades, nobody in public life has been allowed to spend public money on Christian symbols, and certainly not on Christian practices. Are there any holy water founts at U-M Dearborn? Of course not. Yet you defend public monies spent on footbaths.

There is plenty of hatred involved in the activities discussed here, but it is hatred from segments of the Muslim community, not towards them, that is the problem.

How many Muslims in Dearborn support Hezbollah and Hamas? When Muslims openly tell me of their support of those terrorist groups in public, then it is easy to see the support is widespread. Muslim friends tell me they can't go into certain shops anymore because the shopowners know my friends don't support these murderous groups. It is not all Muslims I hate, it is the violent jihad I hate. I have made that clear, but too many AAPAC people want to twist words and pretend that any opposition is based on hatred of Arabs or Muslims.

--by Dearborn Citizen on 8/29/10   Lives: Dearborn  

speaking of fordson, thought you might like to share this with everyone on the main page russ

--by eastend on 9/3/10   Lives: Dearborn  

To Eastend: thanks for the site of that video. The production values are terrific. Fordson looks great. I do have one point about the video, though. The statement seems to be that everything was wonderful in Dearborn until 9/11. That really isn't true. The fundamentalist Muslims were already dominating Dearborn by that time, insisting only Arabic be spoken at the mosques. Public support of terrorist groups was already known. Outside of Dearborn, maybe, 9/11 had a big impact, but inside the city the divisions were already known, and certain Muslims were happy to exploit any fears of their group.

Consider this: Hammoud placed second in the primary election that took place ON 9/11. Despite the fact that Arab-Muslims attacked America, an Arab-Muslim-American placed second in our city, winning the right to face Guido in the general election. Yet, Hammoud phrased the situation as "let us see if Dearborn can overcome its prejudices" in the GENERAL election by voting him Mayor. The fact is, Dearborn had already proven its non-prejudice in the primary. Hammoud ran advertisements before 9/11 in which he accused Guido of prejudice, among other things.

As part of the Fordson community, I can't understand why so many here don't follow that if non-Muslims in Dearborn believed that Muslims were really as patriotic for America as Fadlallah and the other men were saying, there would be very little fear of Muslims. Is it non-Muslims' fault for not being convinced? Or is it Muslims' fault that the public actions and words of some Muslims seem to deny patriotism?

Fadlallah, who in this trailer seems so sincere about loving America, is the same man who has publicly denounced America on more than one occasion. Which statements of his should we believe? You see the problem.

--by Fordson Dad on 9/3/10   Lives: Dearborn  

You people hate Muslims because that’s what you have been and continue to be programmed to do. The media locks on to a few who spew rhetoric and everyone gets scared and blames 100% of all Muslims world wide.

Fact remains that in response to the senseless murder of over 3000 innocent people in NYC on 9-11, the United States led coalition of the willing have taken their anger out on over a million innocent Iraqi's and Afghani’s. After reading all of this, its clear that most of you wont be happy until all Muslims meet the same fate as those in Iraq and Afghanistan who are only guilty of living there.

You should all be proud of how this constitutes a very favorable ratio of innocent Americans killed to innocent Muslims killed. Maybe this will make you all sleep better at night despite all the Hezbollah and Hamas members who are camped out on Fordson’s new football field with the lights on.

--by Sad day to be American on 9/6/10   Lives: Dearborn  

So, I am one of 'you people?' You want to claim that anyone who isn't Muslim must hate Muslims. In that light, you throw down a number of 'a million' Iraqi's and Afghani's being killed since 9/11. I don't know where you get such a number. The reality-based official estimates are much smaller than that. And you sneer at the notion that there are Dearborn citizens that support Hezbollah and Hamas. You can't be claiming that isn't true. The truth of that is publicly repeated frequently. The publisher of the Arab-American News proudly dared the American Government to arrest him when he stated that 'everyone' in Dearborn joined him in supporting Hezbollah.

You want to imply that non-Muslims are bigoted, and then you use the term 'you people.' I guess we know who is really bigoted, don't we?

--by Fordson Dad on 9/6/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Yes, you are one of "those people." Those who are blinded and bigoted by hatred and fear. Just whose "reality-based" number are you referring to? The same "reality-based" people who counted bodies back in Vietnam? You really think your going to get an accurate count of dead civilians from the US government? Even if you went by their ridicules estimates, they say at approx 750,000. Let’s not argue over 250,000 dead Iraqi citizens who were “collateral damage” I will relent to your mere three quarters of a million by US government estimates.

Osama Siblani is no more the voice of Islam than Michael Evans is the voice of Christians. He is a well known radical Christian who has a huge following. Evans is no petty crank who claims to be God-possessed, although his writings might seem to suggest that. The jacket of his book describes him as a 'TIME magazine best-selling author', who has appeared on the BBC and on American television channels and who has written for such papers as the Wall Street Journal and the Jerusalem Post. He hobnobs with the highest of American and Israeli politicians and religious leaders, and is evidently taken very seriously in Christian fundamentalist circles. He openly preaches the global extermination of all non-Christians. Do you support Michael Evans? Do you want Hindu's, Catholics, Jews, and everyone else thinking that all Christians are all supporters of Michael Evans? Openly you say no, but really, who are you kidding? Your posts say all there is to say about how you feel about the usefulness of Muslims to humanity.

I’m not implying that non-Muslims are bigoted, just you and the others who want to hold them all responsible for the words and actions of just a few but don’t want to be viewed in exactly the same way by others.

--by Sad day to be a Christian on 9/7/10   Lives: USA  

Oh, come on, 'Sad Day': you say that I am 'blinded and bigoted' by hate and fear. All I did was point out that the former Fordson principal denounced America on more than one occasion. This is public knowledge. It was printed in the newspapers. How is pointing that out hateful? Every time Fadlallah would do something like fire a wrestling coach because he was Christian, dozens of people would show up at the school board meetings to shout their support for him. Siblani is quoted every time a Detroit newspaper wants a quote. When Siblani uttered the words cited above, thousands - repeat - thousands of men had been chanting their support for Hezobllah in Hemlock Park. Those sounds were carried on National Public Radio, and you can still look up the word-by-word records on the internet. So, it isn't just a 'few' people in Dearborn who support Hezbollah. I wish it were.

And, no matter how you want to keep saying it, I don't hate all Muslims. I hate the jihad. I hate anti-American attitudes that accept Hezbollah killing American soldiers. I would like to be convinced that the Muslim community in Dearborn is really as American-patriotic as the men in the Fordson video claim it is. That isn't what I see in action, and it isn't what I hear. That doesn't make me hateful, as you claim. That makes me a loyal American.

--by You're just Sad on 9/8/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Perhaps as 9-11 approaches, we can all take a step back and pontificate on a few things. I can’t help but wonder if part of the media frenzy and government manipulation of events serves to intentionally divide us. I have no doubt that it does, as sometimes, I am a little too ready to pick a fight for a perceived injustice. Being a proud member of the Fordson community, I am not happy with a lot of what has gone on at Fordson, but we are Tractors for life. I am a non-Muslim who has many Muslim neighbors and friends. I would defend to the death anyone who attempted to attack or berate them for simply being Muslim.

9-11, like Pearl Harbor, should have been a galvanizing event for us. But after Pearl Harbor, our own government imprisoned Japanese Americans for simply being Japanese. Americans sat back and let it happen. If history teaches us anything, it teaches us that we cannot let history like this repeat itself. Fear makes even the best of us do horrible things. Fear of history repeating itself is just as bad as fear of our neighbors who are Muslims. If we allow fear to make us turn on each other, these terrorists win. Many try to find an accessible scapegoat. Here and Dearborn, a lot of good Muslims are an easy target.

My apologies.

--by Yes, I guess I am sad - very sad! on 9/9/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Dear Russ:

I purposefully wanted until the "Terry Jones book burning" event was resolved one way or the other to write in.

I see several of these hate filled posters complaining that Dearborn Muslims are not denouncing the acts of groups like Hezbollah in a grotesquely overt fashion. This is the impetus for the clear ora of hatred in some of their postings.

My question is, now that that issue of this burring of the Quran has been dispensed with, where was all the outrage by these same Americans/Christians who expected the exact same response from Muslims regarding similar acts by Hamas or Hezbollah?

I view Pastor Terry Jones as nothing short of a hate filled terrorist who should be renounced by all Americans and Christians, both of which he claims to be.

Where is this poster named WHEN and people like her to denounce this horrific act?
What a sad and despicable double standard these people have. Should we assume that all Christians and Americans agree with Pastor Terry Jones in that it is acceptable to speak hate filled words and burn the Quran? By the standards set forth by so many of these posters here, perhaps the rest of the world is justified in doing just that.

--by Where is the outrage? on 9/10/10   Lives: Dearborn  

President Obama denounced the nutcase Terry Jones and his book-burning. My input really didn't seem necessary. But, please tell me, when did Hamas or Hezbollah burn Bibles, and when did anyone worry about someone denouncing that kind of act? The acts that non-Muslims want to hear denounced is when Hezbollah kills Americans, as they are currently by supplying training and bombs to thugs in Iraq. How about when Hezbollah starts a war with Israel, then complains because Israel fights back? How about when either of those terrorist groups fire rockets into Israel, sometimes hundreds in a day?

These actions go way beyond book burning, don't they? Burning books is NOT a 'horrific act.' The only way it could be bad news is if someone broke into the public library and burned everybody's books. Still that would be far from 'horrific.'

All that the non-Muslim community sees is support of terror expressed by the Muslim community. You suggest that we are seeking a 'grotesquely overt' denunciation of Hezbollah and Hamas. Nice vocabulary, but what we are seeking is ANY denunciation of those groups. If you are not a supporter of American-killing terrorists, it is understandable that you are tired of being suspected. The only way to fight back against that suspicion is make it known that you don't support terrorism. And your expression of that attitude doesn't have to be grotesque.

--by Not The Same on 9/11/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Book burning and burning the Quran on the Eide (which also happens to fall on 9-11) is not nearly the same. Had this event been switched and an Imam was calling for burning of Bibles on Christmas day in the South End of Dearborn, you would likely be the first one expecting Muslims here to be screaming in the streets to stop. Would you feel that this was the same as if though they were burning Uncle Tom's Cabin?

Am I to understand that you feel that Obama has already spoken for you? Thus, It really was not necessary for all of us to speak out or express outrage? Really?

Many Middle Eastern leaders have spoken out against Hezbollah, Hammas, the PLO, the 9-11 Terrorist attacks and many other issues. Even guys like Mumar Kadafi publicly denounced the 9-11 attacks. Why do you think that a Christian Pastor encouraging other American Christians to desecrate Islam during the most holy time for Muslims in our own country is not worthy of massive outrage? I guess that's your judgment call. With that in mind, perhaps speaking against such atrocious and inflammatory behavior would be a clear message to our Muslim community that neither Americans nor Christians will tolerate such moronic transgressions. Maybe you don’t think burning the Quran on the Eide is a big deal, but it and the silence of the American people on the matter speaks volumes about how we view Muslims. They are not stupid, they see this too.

I guess we have to agree to dis-agree

--by WHERE IS THE OUTRAGE on 9/11/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Oh, stop it, 'Outrage', burning a book is just that..burning a book. Stop with the symbolic overtones. The idiot preacher in the South has a church with fifty members. That's it. And he didn't seem to know he was burning a book on the Eide, he was aiming for 9/11. The media picked up the story because it is so unusual. It is not the general attitude of America. And when Obama spoke out against it, and the Pope, and so many high-ranking non-Muslim Americans, then yes, it wasn't necessary for me to shout on a street corner. America was well-represented. Islam, on the other hand, officially has no central voice. It is necessary, then, for many factions within Islam to be heard denouncing terrorism/jihad whenever that ugly hatred shows itself. In the last ten years alone there have been thousands of deadly jihadist attacks around the world, with dozens right here in America.

And you are really hiding the truth when you claim that 'many' Middle-Eastern leaders have spoken out against Hamas and Hezbollah. Sure, we know that Egypt doesn't like Hamas. That is because Hamas is an arm of Iran, and the Egyptians hate Iran. We know that in Lebanon, many factions hate Hezbollah because Hezbollah is an arm of Iran and is looking to take over Lebanon. Kadafi was terrified that the US would wipe out his army like we did Iraq's, that is why he acted nice. Here in American, terrorist-related groups like CAIR refuse to condemn Hezbollah and Hamas. Oh, they will say they condemn 'terrorism' but they won't admit that those groups are terrorists.

One idiot burning a book is not America 'desecrating' Islam. If Muslims are not stupid, they will see this obvious truth.

--by Not The Same on 9/15/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Sorry, but to the rest of the world, it is exactly the same. As for your little tirade about who does and does not protest Hamas or Hezbollah, it’s all just a lot of hot air. It’s pretty clear that you would find any reason or excuse to hate Muslims because you’re afraid of them. Fact is, only thier leadership speak, not their people. Every time someone points out the fault with your logic, you pull another miniscule meaningless factoid out of your opinion purse and push it as fact.

As stated earlier, let this exact same thing happen when some Muslim Imam starts burning Bibles on Christmas and lets see how “different” it becomes for you.

People like you will be lining up to scream foul and demand action.

--by #7 on 9/17/10   Lives: Dearborn  

You claim, #7, that the world is ignorant, and that their ignorance is supposed to make us woozy with fear? What an argument.

And it must be easy to be you...all you do is fall back on your base argument that everybody else just hates Muslims, that's all, they hate Muslims. People 'like me' hate jihad, not Muslims.

And, as for pointing out 'fault' with my logic, where did anyone do that? There have been false claims about Middle-Eastern opposition to Hezbollah and Hamas, but where has there been fault found with logic?

--by Nope on 9/18/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Some civilized country we are.

We hold ourselves in such moral superiority while people who profess to represent both Americans and Christians want to burn Quran's on the Eide in the name of God and America and you say nothing. Some of you don’t want to speak out, even on an anonymous forum, you say, because Obama did it for you? You’re not fooling anyone, either you agree with burning Qurans, or you simply don’t care. Either way, it doesn’t say much about how "civilized" a nation we have become or how willing we are to stand for what is right and wrong despite what the rest of the world is doing. When did Americans do things based on what the rest of the world was doing? People in Iran died for protesting in the streets against an unfair election of a tyrant. What more do you want? Americans don’t protest anything unless it’s an increase in beer or cigarette tax (and half the time, you won’t even protest that).

--by Yep on 9/18/10   Lives: USA  

Hey, 'Yep': Are you an American, or not? You started out saying 'we' but you ended up saying 'you.'

You ask: 'When did Americans do things based on what the rest of the world was doing?' You are the one who wants to regulate American behavior based on what people in foreign lands believe. You want American freedoms to be curtailed to fit what Sharia law requires.

I think America is very civilized, and that we do stand for what is right, when our politicians have guts enough.

Burning books - owned by the burner - means nothing. How many times have mobs in the Middle East burned our flag? Should we Americans riot in the streets when that happens? Should we threaten to burn mosques when that happens? That would be the equivalent.

Better yet, perhaps we should riot in the streets every time a Christian is murdered because some crazed imam sends his people into the streets looking for blood. If we did that, Americans would be rioting a lot...

--by Which is it? on 9/19/10   Lives: Dearborn  

too bad so sad!! ha ha ha ha!! what can any of you do about it???? NOTHING!

--by NANCY on 11/1/10   Lives: Dearborn  

Russ: Why are you posting doctored, poorly-edited video on your site? You of all people should recognize that this video is fraudulent. Or did you do the doctoring?

--by RUserious? on 11/6/10   Lives: Dearborn  

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